| Subject: | RE: Dogs off leash |
| Date: | 06/28/2001 12:54 AM |
| From: | Mark Jenkins |
|
This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_000_01C1001A.BD797D50 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" I'm not sure that the issue is dogs running 'amok' at all -- it has to do with the assumed priority of various uses of the park and how the city creates opportunities for events like bike races without shutting down other uses entirely for the time of the event. If it hadn't been a dog, it might have been a child or a pedestrian, or a recreational cyclist -- children and pedestrians and cyclists are allowed in the park, as far as I can tell, even on the course, during bicycle races, and I'm not sure the issue is whether or not that activity is licit or illicit. My guess is that all parties, presumably OBRA and the city, negotiate the extent of park closure for special events of this type, and that no guarantees are made about the absolute integrity of the course. If such a guarantee were made, it wouldn't be by the city. The city can't afford it, OBRA can't afford it, and the situation we have is probably the best-case compromise point that allows the event to proceed. I don't think individual litigation will have the effect of making the courses safer -- it is far more likely that everyone concerned will end up saying "why bother to do this?" Yes, the dog should've been leashed -- maybe you can make this about the personal responsibility that person has for controlling their animal and hold that person responsible for that event. This whole thread seems to be an occasion for everyone to talk about who's ethical and responsible and who's not. Or who's an idiot. Or who's a liberal. But that doesn't do anything to mitigate the potential bad effects of a compromise between organizers and venue that you, in order to race in that venue, have implicitly agreed to. People seem to think the compromise is still a good one, overall -- if they didn't, the racing would stop, yes? How much safety and course marshalling do you think that you're owed by virtue of whatever agreements are made? How much priority should or does your agreement with the park grant you over other users? Should the park be closed entirely for these events? Would even be desirable? ------_=_NextPart_000_01C1001A.BD797D50 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Description: RE: [OBRA Chat] Dogs off leash Message-ID: <0.700001901.847154495-951758591-993762720@topica.com> From: "Schreck, George" <george.-@pacificorp.com> Reply-To: george.-@pacificorp.com To: rrr-@aol.com, ob-@topica.com Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] Dogs off leash Date: Thu, 28 Jun 2001 14:11:00 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) List-Help: <http://topica.com/lists/obra/> List-Subscribe: <mailto:obra-su-@topica.com> List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:obra-uns-@topica.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" ============================================================ Search the largest used car inventory on the planet. More than 1.5 million listings, updated daily. Your car is waiting. AutoTrader.com http://click.topica.com/caaacxRaVxiDpaVHrLZb/AutoTrader <http://click.topica.com/caaacxRaVxiDpaVHrLZb/AutoTrader> ============================================================ The problem is when people's dogs run amok how do we deal with that. A number of cyclists were injured by that owner. What are we to do, just accept the risk. How do I know you have your dog under control, and for that matter, since an animal is involved, how can you guaranty that you do. Am I supposed to take the risk that you can control your dog and are we all supposed to cheerfully accept the consequences if you fail. I bet the person who caused the accident thought he had his dog under control. Apparently, you have decided that your desires and your dog's take precedence over everyone else's and that you are above the law in all respects. You have an incredible amount of self-importance to go with your lack of consideration for others. Not a particularly positive attitude for people living in a crowded society. I suppose on the basis for you reasoning, that I should be allowed to speed through you neighborhood in my sports car because I have decided that I can control my automobile and avoid hitting pedestrians and other vehicles. George C. Schreck Phone: (503) 813-7211 Fax: (503) 813-7190 -----Original Message----- From: rrr-@aol.com [ mailto:rrr-@aol.com <mailto:rrr-@aol.com> ] Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2001 12:58 PM To: ob-@topica.com Subject: [OBRA Chat] Dogs off leash ============================================================ SPECIAL OFFER! 10-piece natural beauty kit for only $14.95. + a free knapsack + free shipping on all orders Your Natural Beauty Source - YvesRocherUSA.com http://click.topica.com/caaachpaVxiDpaVzo6Ra/YvesRocher <http://click.topica.com/caaachpaVxiDpaVzo6Ra/YvesRocher> ============================================================ I find it amazing the reaction to dogs off leash. Have you ever thought why we do it. It is for the simple pleasure, joy and excitement that it brings to the dog. The ability to run free. I see it as the same feeling I get from riding down the street, instead of driving. Do I do this to angry motorist, no? Do I let my dog off leash to anger other people, no? I do have a responsibility to keep my dog under control though. But because a few dog owners and bike owners act stupid, doesn't mean rest off us have to pay for it. I will continue to let my dog off leash in a responsible manner, because I love to see her eyes light up when I do. And I will continue to ride my bike no matter how much motorist wish me off the road, because they find me annoying. Was the guy an idiot, yes, but not all of us are. ============================================================ Search the largest used car inventory on the planet. More than 1.5 million listings, updated daily. Your car is waiting. AutoTrader.com http://click.topica.com/caaacxRaVxiDpaVzo6Rf/AutoTrader <http://click.topica.com/caaacxRaVxiDpaVzo6Rf/AutoTrader> ============================================================ To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com. To respond to the list manager send to ob-@teleport.com To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com ============================================================ Developing software is a grueling workout. Outfit yourself with gear made for the long haul. Get tutorials, skills, and code for open standards-based software at developerWorks. http://click.topica.com/caaacwKaVxiDpaVHrLZg/developerWorks <http://click.topica.com/caaacwKaVxiDpaVHrLZg/developerWorks> ============================================================ To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com. To respond to the list manager send to ob-@teleport.com To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com ------_=_NextPart_000_01C1001A.BD797D50-- |
