| Subject: | RE: more centerline discussion |
| Date: | 03/29/2004 03:36 AM |
| From: | Matthew W |
|
--0-215990573-1080600005=:56264 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii "But where was the centerline on a narrow one-lane road with no line. What specific reference prevents a rider from riding up next to you in the middle. I believe that this road was a special case that we see infrequently." First, to repeat: "+ All of the riders were explained the rules at the start of the race. Everyone was told that the road didn’t have a yellow line and that they were still expected stay off the left lane or they were breaking the rules." There was certainly a consensus on the location of the centerline, as evidenced by the majority of the peloton's lack of difficulty complying with the centerline rule even on the section with out a painted line. Approximately one dozen riders chose the "see no evil, hear no evil" approach and advanced past the rest of us that were respecting the "invisible" line. If any of those riders who advanced past twenty or so other riders in the course of twenty seconds are on this list: you risked people's lives in order to advance in an amateur bike race, hello? We all know that it is quite difficult to advance that number of spaces in a short period of time when the peoloton is bunched up and not drafting in a single or double line. Second, I am disappointed that I was the only member of the peoloton willing to look like a complete idiot screaming bloody murder at the aforementioned cheaters. It was my understanding that obra-land had agreed that we would not tolerate this sort of behavior. Was I wrong, because it sure felt like that's what you were saying by remaining silent? "Schreck, George" <george.-@pacificorp.com> wrote: But where was the centerline on a narrow one-lane road with no line. What specific reference prevents a rider from riding up next to you in the middle. I believe that this road was a special case that we see infrequently. -----Original Message----- From: Dave Whitlinger [mailto:david.l.w-@intel.com] Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 1:48 PM To: ob-@topica.com Subject: RE: [OBRA Chat] more centerline discussion ===========================================================**** Bounces like rubber! Shatters like ceramic! ****Discover Crazy Aaron's Thinking Putty in grown up handfuls. It's the creativity unleashing, mood enhancing desk toy!http://click.topica.com/caab4CEaVxiDpaVzo6Rb/Crazy Aaron Enterprises=========================================================== Here is one perspective and some details for those that weren’t in the race: + All of the riders were explained the rules at the start of the race. Everyone was told that the road didn’t have a yellow line and that they were still expected stay off the left lane or they were breaking the rules. + In the CAT 4/5 race, on the lap in question, a break occurred before the turn onto the narrow road without a centerline. It was a small break with 2-3 riders and as it happened, the team mates of one of the riders in the break were at the front of the main peleton going into the turn. As is expected, the team mates on the front of the peleton did not try to catch up to the break. They eased off and let the break go. That’s called bike racing. + Around 10-15 riders didn’t like this tactic and decided to ride over the centerline, pass the peleton and catch up with the break. There was no question that riders were making a conscious decision to cheat. Several riders got bunched up in the left lane and ended up taking over the whole road at one point. Other riders in the peleton were calling out numbers of the offending riders and I’m sure some riders decided that if the rules weren’t going to be enforced, they were going to take advantage of the situation as well. + In the end, after about 15 riders broke the rules and caught up with the break. The rest of the peleton decided catch up rather than let the offending riders profit from the situation. In subsequent laps, the peleton was mostly strung out on that stretch of road so there weren’t more issues. What occurred was dangerous and very unsporting. I don’t think the race promoters can be held responsible – they do everything they can to put the event on. The least the riders can do is play by the rules and ride a fair and safe race. Follow the rules or don’t race…go for a ride with your friends and let the rest of us have a fair, safe contest. Dave --------------------------------- From: Jerald Powell [mailto:jpow-@spiritone.com] Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 12:22 PM To: mad-@huttig.com Cc: dirty-@attbi.com; ob-@topica.com Subject: Re: [OBRA Chat] more centerline discussion Come on folks... ride the bike. The piece of road in question has been a part of many, if not most piece of cake races since the first one I rode... I think in 1980 or '81, can't be sure. Having not been there this weekend, I don't know what y'all were doing out there, but in the past, the lead car usually went far enough ahead to shut down on-coming traffic. By the way, it's the same thing on a forest service road, or any other non-center line road for that matter. So do you go neutral in that kind of situation? I guess you could, but the reasonable (and tactically correct) way to ride that kind of racing situation is to make sure you're at or off the front when you enter that road. If you were caught back in the pack when you left the good road , you're going to have a long day, 'cause the leaders can and should be putting some distance on you. As they say. That's road racing. Jerry On Mar 29, 2004, at 9:44 AM, Adams, Mike wrote: I know I am just one, but unless this situation gets some serious attention then that is the last time I will do piece of cake. The way to handle no center line is to go neutral and everyone holds his\her position. This would be the fair thing to do. The first and second corner on that stretch of rode are blind and all it would take is for a disgruntled driver, who can drive on that side of the rode at the speed posted or there about, to cut the corner and many riders are injured seriously or fatally. I do not think we need this type of incident for OBRA. Just my opinion. Mike Adams -----Original Message----- From: Nick Glazener [mailto:dirty-@attbi.com] Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 8:50 AM To: ob-@topica.com Subject: [OBRA Chat] more centerline discussion The POC presented some unique center line challenges on Dannon Rd.. I understood that the centerline rule still applied even on the narrow Dannon Rd.. That would have been very difficult since there was no clear center line. There was a lot of confusion about the issue within the pack (4/5). After a couple laps it was obvious to me that if I respected the rule, then I was going to loose position in the pack to those that were ignoring the rule. As most racers know, the safest place was in the front quarter of the pack. None of the riders that were attacking the left side of the road wanted to actually share the pace workload. I broke the rule on the third lap to get up the front third. It didn't do me any any good because there were 3 times as many offenders that passed me. There was a lot of verbal bantering. One rider was quite verbal about pointing out the offending riders by number. It was annoying but appropriate to use peer pressure. It was potentially a very dangerous situation if there had been a car up. There was also some frustration with a team sending riders up in a break away and then blocking at the front (another topic). It would have been a very difficult job for an official to monitor and enforce. There wasn't even a safe place for an official's car to come along the side and warn offending riders. I wonder if it would be safe to have the official car travel on the left side of the pack for those narrow roads. The same situation exist for those races that use Forrest Service roads. However, those roads tend to be in the hills which thin the pack out. I don't think there any easy answers for this. I expect the official response to be, "the rule was in effect and officials should have enforced it." The application in reality may not be so easy. In the end, it all sorted itself out for a good finish and no injuries from a center line violation. Jerald M Powell, AICP Community Planning 1926 SW Madison Street Portland, OR 97205 503 222 7173 503 799 7823 jpow-@spiritone.com ===========================================================**** Bounces like rubber! Shatters like ceramic! ****Discover Crazy Aaron's Thinking Putty in grown up handfuls. It's the creativity unleashing, mood enhancing desk toy!http://click.topica.com/caab5n2aVxiDpaVzo6Rg/Crazy Aaron Enterprises=========================================================== To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.orgTo unsubscribe send toobra-un-@topica.com ===========================================================**** Bounces like rubber! Shatters like ceramic! ****Discover Crazy Aaron's Thinking Putty in grown up handfuls. It's the creativity unleashing, mood enhancing desk toy!http://click.topica.com/caab5n2aVxiDpa7qhHdg/ Crazy Aaron Enterprises=========================================================== To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com.To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.orgTo unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ This email is confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended solely for the addressee. Access to this email by anyone else, unless expressly approved by the sender or an authorized addressee, is unauthorized. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, distribution or any action omitted or taken in reliance on it, is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you believe that you have received this email in error, please contact the sender, delete this e-mail and destroy all copies. ============================================================================== --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time. --0-215990573-1080600005=:56264 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii <DIV> <DIV> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">"<SPAN class=512130722-29032004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>But where was the centerline on a narrow one-lane road with no line. What specific reference prevents a rider from riding up next to you in the middle. I believe that this road was a special case that we see infrequently."</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">First, to repeat:</SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">"+ All of the riders were explained the rules at the start of the race. Everyone was told that the road didn’t have a yellow line and that they were still expected stay off the left lane or they were breaking the rules."</SPAN></FONT></P> <DIV>There was certainly a consensus on the location of the centerline, as evidenced by the majority of the peloton's lack of difficulty complying with the centerline rule even on the section with out a painted line. Approximately one dozen riders chose the "see no evil, hear no evil" approach and advanced past the rest of us that were respecting the "invisible" line. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>If any of those riders who advanced past twenty or so other riders in the course of twenty seconds are on this list: you risked people's lives in order to advance in an amateur bike race, hello?</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>We all know that it is quite difficult to advance that number of spaces in a short period of time when the peoloton is bunched up and not drafting in a single or double line. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Second,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>I am disappointed that I was the only member of the peoloton willing to look like a complete idiot screaming bloody murder at the aforementioned cheaters. It was my understanding that obra-land had agreed that we would not tolerate this sort of behavior. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Was I wrong, because it sure felt like that's what you were saying by remaining silent?</DIV> <DIV><BR><B><I>"Schreck, George" <george.-@pacificorp.com></I></B> wrote:</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid"> <DIV><SPAN class=512130722-29032004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>But where was the centerline on a narrow one-lane road with no line. What specific reference prevents a rider from riding up next to you in the middle. I believe that this road was a special case that we see infrequently.</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV></DIV> <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> Dave Whitlinger [mailto:david.l.w-@intel.com] <BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, March 29, 2004 1:48 PM<BR><B>To:</B> ob-@topica.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: [OBRA Chat] more centerline discussion<BR><BR></FONT></DIV><PRE>=========================================================== **** Bounces like rubber! Shatters like ceramic! **** Discover Crazy Aaron's Thinking Putty in grown up handfuls. It's the creativity unleashing, mood enhancing desk toy! <A href="http://click.topica.com/caab4CEaVxiDpaVzo6Rb/">http://click.topica.com/caab4CEaVxiDpaVzo6Rb/</A> Crazy Aaron Enterprises =========================================================== </PRE> <DIV class=Section1> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Here is one perspective and some details for those that weren’t in the race:</SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">+ All of the riders were explained the rules at the start of the race. Everyone was told that the road didn’t have a yellow line and that they were still expected stay off the left lane or they were breaking the rules.</SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">+ In the CAT 4/5 race, on the lap in question, a break occurred before the turn onto the narrow road without a centerline. It was a small break with 2-3 riders and as it happened, the team mates of one of the riders in the break were at the front of the main peleton going into the turn. As is expected, the team mates on the front of the peleton did not try to catch up to the break. They eased off and let the break go. That’s called bike racing.</SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">+ Around 10-15 riders didn’t like this tactic and decided to ride over the centerline, pass the peleton and catch up with the break. There was no question that riders were making a conscious decision to cheat. Several riders got bunched up in the left lane and ended up taking over the whole road at one point. Other riders in the peleton were calling out numbers of the offending riders and I’m sure some riders decided that if the rules weren’t going to be enforced, they were going to take advantage of the situation as well.</SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">+ In the end, after about 15 riders broke the rules and caught up with the break. The rest of the peleton decided catch up rather than let the offending riders profit from the situation. In subsequent laps, the peleton was mostly strung out on that stretch of road so there weren’t more issues.</SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">What occurred was dangerous and very unsporting. I don’t think the race promoters can be held responsible – they do everything they can to put the event on. The least the riders can do is play by the rules and ride a fair and safe race. Follow the rules or don’t race…go for a ride with your friends and let the rest of us have a fair, safe contest.</SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Dave</SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <DIV> <DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> <HR tabIndex=-1 align=center width="100%" SIZE=2> </SPAN></FONT></DIV> <P class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"> Jerald Powell [mailto:jpow-@spiritone.com] <BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Monday, March 29, 2004 12:22 PM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> mad-@huttig.com<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Cc:</SPAN></B> dirty-@attbi.com; ob-@topica.com<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Re: [OBRA Chat] more centerline discussion</SPAN></FONT></P></DIV> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Come on folks... ride the bike. The piece of road in question has been a part of many, if not most piece of cake races since the first one I rode... I think in 1980 or '81, can't be sure. Having not been there this weekend, I don't know what y'all were doing out there, but in the past, the lead car usually went far enough ahead to shut down on-coming traffic. By the way, it's the same thing on a forest service road, or any other non-center line road for that matter. So do you go neutral in that kind of situation? I guess you could, but the reasonable (and tactically correct) way to ride that kind of racing situation is to make sure you're at or off the front when you enter that road. If you were caught back in the pack when you left the good road , you're going to have a long day, 'cause the leaders can and should be putting some distance on you. </SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">As they say. That's road racing. </SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Jerry </SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">On Mar 29, 2004, at 9:44 AM, Adams, Mike wrote: </SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">I know I am just one, but unless this situation gets some serious attention then that is the last time I will do piece of cake. The way to handle no center line is to go neutral and everyone holds his\her position. This would be the fair thing to do. The first and second corner on that stretch of rode are blind and all it would take is for a disgruntled driver, who can drive on that side of the rode at the speed posted or there about, to cut the corner and many riders are injured seriously or fatally. I do not think we need this type of incident for OBRA. Just my opinion. </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Mike Adams </SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">-----Original Message----- </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">From: Nick Glazener [mailto:dirty-@attbi.com] </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 8:50 AM </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">To: ob-@topica.com </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Subject: [OBRA Chat] more centerline discussion </SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">The POC presented some unique center line challenges on Dannon Rd.. I </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">understood that the centerline rule still applied even on the narrow </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Dannon Rd.</SPAN></FONT>. That would have been very difficult since there was no </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">clear center line. There was a lot of confusion about the issue within </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">the pack (4/5). After a couple laps it was obvious to me that if I </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">respected the rule, then I was going to loose position in the pack to </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">those that were ignoring the rule. As most racers know, the safest </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">place was in the front quarter of the pack. None of the riders that </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">were attacking the left side of the road wanted to actually share the </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">pace workload. </SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">I broke the rule on the third lap to get up the front third. It didn't </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">do me any any good because there were 3 times as many offenders that </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">passed me. </SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">There was a lot of verbal bantering. One rider was quite verbal about </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">pointing out the offending riders by number. It was annoying but </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">appropriate to use peer pressure. It was potentially a very dangerous </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">situation if there had been a car up. There was also some frustration </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">with a team sending riders up in a break away and then blocking at the </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">front (another topic). </SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">It would have been a very difficult job for an official to monitor and </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">enforce. There wasn't even a safe place for an official's car to come </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">along the side and warn offending riders. I wonder if it would be safe </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">to have the official car travel on the left side of the pack for those </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">narrow roads. </SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">The same situation exist for those races that use Forrest Service roads. </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">However, those roads tend to be in the hills which thin the pack out. </SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">I don't think there any easy answers for this. I expect the official </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">response to be, "the rule was in effect and officials should have </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">enforced it." The application in reality may not be so easy. </SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">In the end, it all sorted itself out for a good finish and no injuries </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">from a center line violation. </SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Jerald M Powell, AICP </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><I><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-STYLE: italic">Community Planning</SPAN></FONT></I> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">1926 SW Madison Street</SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">Portland</SPAN></FONT>, OR 97205 </P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">503 222 7173 </SPAN></FONT></P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">503 799 7823 </SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"></SPAN></FONT> </P> <P><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">jpow-@spiritone.com </SPAN></FONT></P></DIV><PRE>=========================================================== **** Bounces like rubber! Shatters like ceramic! **** Discover Crazy Aaron's Thinking Putty in grown up handfuls. It's the creativity unleashing, mood enhancing desk toy! <A href="http://click.topica.com/caab5n2aVxiDpaVzo6Rg/">http://click.topica.com/caab5n2aVxiDpaVzo6Rg/</A> Crazy Aaron Enterprises =========================================================== </PRE><PRE>To respond to the whole group send to ob-@topica.com. To respond to the list manager send to cmur-@obra.org To unsubscribe send to obra-uns-@topica.com</PRE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE>=========================================================== **** Bounces like rubber! Shatters like ceramic! **** Discover Crazy Aaron's Thinking Putty in grown up handfuls. 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